buylotrogold

Count 1 < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message ... Taking orders, yeah.   At least initially.    Note there are two aspects to orders - taking them and executing them. So as soon as they execute their orders you'll firm up an opinion? No. So can you describe the conditions you would need to actually firm up an opinion here? No, they would be hypothetical.

kuff (Isaac Adams) < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message Count 1 < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message ... Taking orders, yeah.   At least initially.    Note there are two aspects to orders - taking them and executing them. So as soon as they execute their orders you'll firm up an opinion? No. So can you describe the conditions you would need to actually firm up an opinion here? No, they would be hypothetical. No - they would be conditions.  A list of needed elements for you to come to a conclusion.  Placing predictions on the events outcome would be hypothetical, but not the conditions themselves.  They would be what you need to come to a formed opinion. The snippage and negative tone here makes me feel you think I am attacking you.  I'm not, and I'm truly sorry if I gave you that impression.   I'm just interested in seeing if you see collaboration with oppression here, as you do with police officers.   I'm not attempting to expose a contradiction from you, so there's no need to be so defensive. And I still don't see your logic in: They're not really collaborating - they're replacing the pushed out occupiers.

Count 1 < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message kuff (Isaac Adams) < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message Count 1 < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it wrote in message ... Taking orders, yeah.   At least initially.    Note there are two aspects to orders - taking them and executing them. So as soon as they execute their orders you'll firm up an opinion? No. So can you describe the conditions you would need to actually firm up an opinion here? No, they would be hypothetical. No - they would be conditions.  A list of needed elements for you to come to a conclusion.  Placing predictions on the events outcome would be hypothetical, but not the conditions themselves.  They would be what you need to come to a formed opinion. The snippage and negative tone here makes me feel you think I am attacking you.  I'm not, and I'm truly sorry if I gave you that impression.   I'm just interested in seeing if you see collaboration with oppression here, as you do with police officers.   I'm not attempting to expose a contradiction from you, so there's no need to be so defensive. And I still don't see your logic in: They're not really collaborating - they're replacing the pushed out occupiers. Okay.   My above quote is simplistic, Paine-istic prose. In reality it's more complicated than that.   The US is withdrawing from Fallujah and handing over control to Sunni Iraqi military.    Is the Iraqi general more loyal to Iraq or to the US?   Does he see the interests of Iraq and the US coenciding or does he see them as conflicting?    I don't know. The US is very interested in driving a wedge between Iraqi Sunnis and Shi'ites. Is this a case of the US firing a shot across the bow of the Iraqi Shi'ites by indicating the US is prepared to do a deal with the Sunnis that will exclude the Shi'ites from power?   I don't know. The US is very interested in putting the best face on the handover so of course it will play up the aspects of the Iraqi forces being under the control of and cheerfully taking US orders.    Will the General really do that?    I don't know. One report says some of the current Resistance fighters in Fallujah will join the Iraqi force in control of Fallujah.   Does this mean these fighters have 'seen the light' and come over to the US side of things?    Probably not.   Does this mean the Iraqi force is compatible with at least some of the _object_ives of the Resistance?   Probably. The recent use of Iraqi security forces against/in Fallujah shows a greater than 50% failure rate of those elements to support US military needs and _object_ives. Those security forces are heavily infiltrated with Resistance members if the Iraqi Resistance is in any way competent (and they do seem to be).    While US control, in the sense of giving orders to the Iraq forces and having them apparently followed, may seem to be in place when things are relatively quiet while the US is withdrawing,  if things heat up again will the General (and his forces) be loyal to US or Iraqi _object_ives?   Probably Iraqi. In a sense I suppose your question about whether or not the General and the members of his Iraqi force are collaborating with the Occupation could be ass backwards.   It may be that the Occupation is collaborating with the General rather than the General with the Occupation. One way the General could indicate where he stands, not today maybe but next week or next month, is which flag he has at his headquarters - the Occupation flag or the Iraqi flag.

flag or the Iraqi flag. I don't see how's there any two ways about it.  The general is there at the orders of the US, he is executing US orders and therefore US policy.  I don't see any set of conditions, not enemy infiltration, flag colors, sunni/shiite politics, or the generals internal convictions as changing those facts. He is a collaborator.  He might end up, as you say above, switching allegiances down the road, but up and until that happens he is a collaborator.

you, so there's no need to be so defensive. And I still don't see your logic in: They're not really collaborating - they're replacing the pushed out occupiers. Okay.   My above quote is simplistic, Paine-istic prose. Your prose would probably give Paine a pain.  Our forces didn't get pushed out of Fallujah